Bug 13704

Maybe it should say:
"We will remove the following packages if you un-check the box below"
If that is the correct interpretation.

On further testing in Mga5B2 it seems that the logic is reversed.

With both boxes checked it proceeds to remove packages, which is correct according to the preamble text. The user takes no action and the packages are removed. 

However it is the text against the checkbox that is incorrect/confusing.

"Unused hardware support" when checked would, to me, indicate that support for unused hardware would be retained, so to remove the unwanted packages I would un-check it.

The check box should be labelled "Remove support for unused hardware" and similarly for the other check box.

This still affects Mga5-RC

I propose to change the preamble into:

"We have detected that some packages are not needed for your system configuration.
We will remove the following packages, unless you de-select them"

and leave the rest the same.

The reason is, that I cannot properly translate your proposal "We will remove the following packages,.......: Remove support for ... " 

After "We will remove the following packages....:", in my language a list and/or category of packages is expected. "Remove support for....." is neither, even if it is /about/ a category.

If you agree, then I can commit s/you choose otherwise/de-select them/ to git right after Mageia 5 release.
Not earlier, because there is no way this can be translated in time for enough languages before stable release, so most translations would show the English string.

I wouldn't know how to build a test-LiveCD, though :-/

Btw, you addressed tv, but Live installer was blino's toy and now it is tmb's ;-)

CC: thierry.vignaud => marja11, tmb

Well that would be better than the current situation, but unless it can be done *before* the final Live isos are released, then it will not appear until Mga6, as it only affects the live installer.

Can the check box labels not be also changed to just 'Hardware' and 'Languages' (I think the second is languages from memory) so that the labels do not imply anything.
At present "Unused hardware support" means in English, "Support for unused hardware" which is the opposite to the action of the check box.

In my langu(In reply to Barry Jackson from comment #5)
> Well that would be better than the current situation, but unless it can be
> done *before* the final Live isos are released, then it will not appear
> until Mga6, as it only affects the live installer.

Indeed, it'll be Mga6
Sorry, we cannot break the translation for the rest of the world just to make it better for the English.

> 
> Can the check box labels not be also changed to just 'Hardware' and
> 'Languages' (I think the second is languages from memory) so that the labels
> do not imply anything.

Then it would become: 
"We will remove the following packages, unless you de-select them:
v Hardware
v Localization"

I can't do that, sorry, to me that sounds worse than it was :-(

Btw, IIUC, the strings come from 
http://gitweb.mageia.org/software/drakx/tree/perl-install/pkgs.pm (I do not find them in .../software/draklive-install )

A screenshot of the current screen is here: https://wiki.mageia.org/en/File:UnusedHardware.PNG

CC'ing isolde, because she's a native English speaker, knows a lot about translating and also had a problem with this Live installer screen when she started using Mageia.

Also CC'ing doktor5000, because he knows more about Mageia users and what confuses them, than anyone else. And he's the one who'll have to deal with many of them, if we make that screen worse instead of better.

@ Florian
How many users have complained about this screen in the forums?

CC: (none) => cmrisolde, doktor5000

Btw, IIUC the "Advanced" screen uses "Unused hardware support" and "Unused localization", too. They seem to be labels for the lists you see after clicking the "Advanced" button. See the "{ label => " parts in pkgs.pm :


N("We have detected that some packages are not needed for your system configuration.") . "\n" .
	N("We will remove the following packages, unless you choose otherwise:"),
	[
	 if_(@unused_hardware_packages,
	     { text => N("Unused hardware support"), val => \$hardware, type => "bool" },
	     { label => N("Unused hardware support") . "\n" . join("\n", map { "  " . $_ } sort(@unused_hardware_packages)), advanced => 1 },
	 ),
	 if_(@unselected_locales,
	     { text => N("Unused localization"), val => \$locales, type => "bool" },
	     { label => N("Unused localization") . "\n"  . join("\n", map { "  " . $_ } sort(@unselected_locales)), advanced => 1 },


We should check the advanced screen, too.

(In reply to Marja van Waes from comment #6)
> 
> @ Florian
> How many users have complained about this screen in the forums?

Quite a lot, for those that simply accepted the defaults, as often it removes a lot more then expected. See e.g. https://wiki.mageia.org/en/Mageia_2_Errata#Removing_unused_drivers.2Flocales
To clarify, in the past the default would remove the packages unless the user chose otherwise IIRC.

But now for your actual question :)
For the translation, nobody complained AFAIR. If it would be me, simply skip that screen completely, then everybody should be happy. IMHO removing hardware support/unused drivers is never a good idea, as it might change after installation. Remove a currently unused wireless driver, and need it later on, and have no cable at hand to bootstrap your machine to be able to install the driver. Chicken/egg problem.

(In reply to Florian Hubold from comment #8)
> (In reply to Marja van Waes from comment #6)
> > 
> > @ Florian
> > How many users have complained about this screen in the forums?
> 
> Quite a lot, for those that simply accepted the defaults, as often it
> removes a lot more then expected. See e.g.
> https://wiki.mageia.org/en/Mageia_2_Errata#Removing_unused_drivers.2Flocales
> To clarify, in the past the default would remove the packages unless the
> user chose otherwise IIRC.

Luckily, very many drivers are kept now, see the long list after: 
    # Packages to not remove even if they seem unused
    my @wanted_hardware_packages = qw(
in http://gitweb.mageia.org/software/drakx/tree/perl-install/pkgs.pm
> 
> But now for your actual question :)
> For the translation, nobody complained AFAIR. If it would be me, simply skip
> that screen completely, then everybody should be happy. IMHO removing
> hardware support/unused drivers is never a good idea, as it might change
> after installation. Remove a currently unused wireless driver, and need it
> later on, and have no cable at hand to bootstrap your machine to be able to
> install the driver. Chicken/egg problem.

For drivers, that is a good idea. For locales, if that screen is skipped, it might be better to keep the current default.

IMHO this should be fixed for 6 final. It is old enough to make this understandable for other than devs and testers

Keywords: (none) => 6sta1
CC: (none) => dvgevers

What is the current status here?


Since Mageia 7 have a new use for cleaning a running system: Live stick persistance.
When you create a Live USB stick with persistent partition, you want to update the software some time, and easiest is of course to update all.

Problem is that with the hundreds of packages of localisations, including firefox, libreoffice...  It takes *much* unnecessary time and space.

It would be great if a cleaning utility could be used here.

Keywords: 6sta1 => (none)
CC: (none) => fri
Target Milestone: Mageia 6 => Mageia 8

The utility works great, especially after recent update where it also removes unused Lbreoffice help files.

*I* think the panel is OK too, closing.

Reopen if you have other ideas.

Status: NEW => RESOLVED
Resolution: (none) => WORKSFORME